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Pointy Hats Redux

It's funny, in re-reading my pointy hat entry from yesterday, I realize it sounds like, at the end, I'm overwhelmed by the work and displeased I have to change all the dresses, but that's not true! It's just a thing on a list.

I tend to wonder if I get bogged down in writing long journal entries about problems in my writing, and the entry itself is taxing, and it deflates my mood about the work. Well. Duly noted! I should probably walk away from such entries for a few moments, and finish them up properly, with a bang. The whole thing was meant to be a lighthearted exploration of how one is occasionally thwarted by bad research materials.

On the other hand, I DID finally stumble across a few references to "transitional" gowns, as well as "widely-laced gowns," WITH hennins, which more fits with the drawings in The Evolution of Fashion: http://cadieux.mediumaevum.com/burgundian-hennin.html (the transitional gowns are at the bottom of the page) However, the references are few, and not worth throwing my medievalist readers out of the story for. :)

I still have the problem that I'm putting Romanian women in basically French dresses, figuring on fashion dissemination, because there just aren't English-language reference materials on much of Romanian history, at least, not the nitpicky details thereof. (Plenty on Dracula. Boy howdy.) I still find it a wonder that I got a book on fortified Transylvanian churches. And learning Romanian is all well and good, but mostly, I can get to a bathroom, and buy a drink in a bar, at this stage, and am not ready to do heavy duty research.

Actually, with my Romance language background and a dictionary, I can puzzle through a page of Romanian text without nuance; but to do SEARCHES in Romanian is a different story altogether. Romanian Wikipedia worked for some of the folklore and such, but Wikipedia isn't so great on things like "medieval noble women's dress." Also, Wikipedia in general, not so great, akshully, but we know that.

I'm just saying.

This was part of why I wanted to go to Romania. But seriously, I'd need to sell and get the money for a double handful of foreign rights like, tomorrow, to make that happen in a timely enough fashion. *sigh* (Now there's a REAL sigh.)

Now, the problem is, I've perhaps been approaching my research rather straightforwardly. Literature searches, mainly, have been how I do things. And it's good, as far as it goes, but maybe not in a little-translated language that was behind the Iron Curtain for so long. It's time to poke at other resources, other possibilities. Make contacts. Oh, look! A page of resources I should have already known about! http://www.icrny.org/d30-2-Romanian_Studies_Resources_in_USA.html#libraries%20and%20other%20resources And look, there's a huge collection of Romanian materials in Urbana, where no less than 2 of my friends live and would probably let me crash!

I could actually speak with a reference librarian!

Ahem. I hate when I'm obtuse.



( 16 comments — Leave a comment )
May. 18th, 2010 01:44 pm (UTC)
Court women might have worn French fashions, but I thought the rest were in German or Russian fashions, with regional variations.
May. 18th, 2010 01:54 pm (UTC)
It's hard to say with Romanians. The court women were probably wearing Hungarian fashion at the time. That's not much easier to find. The culture flow was not typically between Russia and Romania at this point (not even Kievan Russia). Poland, a little. It's also hard to find the 1480s fashions from Poland and Hungary, I might add! The Saxon migration into Transylvania (as sponsored by Hungary) might make a German influence the most likely.

The few visual references of males at the time show them in clothes that fit with the female dresses I'm picking out, so I do have that much to go on.

Fwiw, I'm rock solid on my main character's clothes, as a peasant. It's the dang court ladies who are messing me up.
May. 18th, 2010 06:15 pm (UTC)
I wonder if anything's been translated from Romanian into French. If so, I can help.
May. 18th, 2010 08:01 pm (UTC)
Of the materials available to me, a very little bit--but I'm good at reading French. Or rather, good enough. Particularly anthropological/archaeological French--a huge chunk of my sources for my big three anthro papers in college were in French!

But thanks!
May. 18th, 2010 08:02 pm (UTC)
I hate when I'm obtuse.

Every time I hear it. Every. Time.
May. 18th, 2010 09:27 pm (UTC)
I have absolutely no idea what this means.
May. 18th, 2010 10:24 pm (UTC)
May. 18th, 2010 10:34 pm (UTC)
It's Warden Norton from The Shawshank Redemption. #1 on the IMDB Top 250!

Have you not seen this? If not, you are getting it for the next celebration-oriented holiday, 'cause that needs to be rectified immediately.
May. 19th, 2010 05:14 pm (UTC)
I've seen it, a couple of times, but not to the obsession point, obvs...
May. 18th, 2010 10:25 pm (UTC)
Want me to ask my friend-the-recreational-medievalist who has done a lot of research on Romanian life, including clothing?
May. 19th, 2010 05:14 pm (UTC)
Uhm, heck yes!
May. 19th, 2010 12:19 am (UTC)
We have an official guest bedroom.

I didn't think your previous entry sounded upset. But then, I spent most of it wondering where the word "hennin" came from and trying to remember how I'd pictured the hats in the draft I'd read. (Because if you said "butterfly hennin", I'd have no idea what that meant.)
May. 19th, 2010 05:15 pm (UTC)
I would like to apply to be an official guest, then. :)

May. 19th, 2010 11:59 am (UTC)
During medieval times, Wallachian and Moldavian princesses (there was no Romania but three Danubian principalities, Wallachia, Moldavia and Transylvania) were wearing Byzantium fashion):

May. 19th, 2010 05:13 pm (UTC)
My area is pretty much in Maramures, with a stronger Hungarian influence, not Wallachia/Moldavia/Transylvania; and Byzantium had fallen by this point in time, so I'm dubious, but I will take that under advisement.
May. 19th, 2010 09:54 pm (UTC)
Shame I don't live near you (or even in the same country) or I could nip round to yours with my (if I say so myself) impressive set of medieval frocks wot I made.

Without wishing to dis the SCA (whose events I have also attended and enjoyed) most of my 15th century kit was made for an accuracy-obsessed English War of the Roses medieval re-enactment group, so it's probably as close as you can get without access to a time machine; once I'd made everything I could think of for that period I moved on to a slavishly accurate 14th century group. Yes, since you ask, I do have a bit of a frock habit. (And I've, er, got two butterfly hennins. Amongst other headdresses.)

If you did want to ask any frock-related questions, and think I can help, please give me a shout, though my knowledge is largely limited to English fashion, and I imagine you already know far more about Romanian dress than I do.
( 16 comments — Leave a comment )

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